Played an '08 Les Paul Standard

[Tinknocker]

I started shopping around for a Les Paul yesterday. Nobody in my area has the Classic Custom w/P-90s that I've been drooling over online, damn it! So I go into the local Guitar Center and they have one 2008 LP Standard in Cherry Sunburst. Looking at it straight on it appears to be a plain top. But when looking down while in the playing position the flame really pops out. When I picked it up it felt extremely light. I know it's chambered, but I never thought a Lester could be lighter than my '02 American Strat! The new asymetrical neck profile was really comfortable and not as extreme as I expected. The Burst Bucker 1&2 pickups sounded fantastic.

My only complaints were the set up and the volume and tone knobs. When you turned the knobs, they wobble :WTF:! Not just one, all four of them! For $2600 you would think they could drill the hole for the pot shafts straight!! As for the action, the strings felt like rubber bands. I know, I'm used to playing Fenders strung with .10's. But the last time I played my Buddys Les Paul {a Joe Perry Bone Yard} the string tension felt fine. Maybe a good set- up could fix it?

So the search continues......

[Tinknocker]

Almost forgot to mention the Grover Locking tuners are a great feature but the locking output jack ain't my cup of tea.

[Bytor1975]

I wonder if it was just loose knobs or play in the pot shafts?

I am curious about that new neck myself.

[Tinknocker]

It's not that there was any slop or play in the pots, seemed like the holes in the knobs weren't drilled straight. A new set of knobs would be a cheap quick fix. But like I said, for that kind of money, it better be perfect!

[Bytor1975]

I was at a local store today and was there as they opened up their first of the new 2008 LP Standards with all of the new 'changes'. It looks great! A very nice vintage sunburst, with just a little bit of flame in it. I was the second guy (after one of the employees) to play the guitar. Some thoughts:

It has a big PLEK sticker on it letting you know it has run through a Plek machine. The neck on this guitar was fantastic! I just love the new shape all the way up and down the neck, and the frets were DEAD on level looking down the neck. The PLEK and new shape are a great idea!

Generally, the fit and finish on this guitar was very nice... until we turned it over and there was a HUGE 3/4 inch GASH in the back edge of the body! NICE! That one is going back to Nashville. Someone didn't inspect that one very well when it left the factory, and we know we didn't do it since we opened it from Gibson.

The next issue, like Tinknocker brought up were the control knobs. They looked TERRIBLE! Tin was right, it is like the holes were not drilled correctly, and as you spin the knobs, they all are off-center and wobbly looking. The four of us looking over the guitar couldn't get over how bad this looked. It looked like some cheap knock-off Asian fake.

Personally, I don't like the locking Grovers. I'd prefer Klusons or the original style Grovers. If your Les Paul keeps going out of tune, you need to relearn how to string your guitar. It isn't like it has a Floyd Rose on the other end.

The rear backplate covering the control cavity for some reason is a smoked/clear plastic. So basically you can see inside the control cavity. Why you would want is beyond me, especially since it is filled with a PRINTED CIRCUIT BOARD? Yep, it has the square looking potentiometers attached to a PCB instead of being wired. It looks like shit.

It sounded great, just like Burstbucker 1 and 2s. Most of you probably know how they sound, so nothing new here.

And finally, the locking jack. I'd probably break it. LOL!

In conclusion, I won't buy one. Too many things I don't like about it, but I do hope they start using that neck on other models. The finish, PUPS, neck shape and PLEK job are winners... but the rest of the guitar to me just stunk.

[Bytor1975]

Take a bite out of this:

http://i335.photobucket.com/albums/m446/MarshallCrunch/LPElectronmics.jpg

[Andoni]

Thats bloody dismal (QC) on behalf of Gibson and that control cavitiy shot looks shocking to say the least.
I played one last week and have to say that I honestly didn't like the neck, too wide for my liking. But since my Les Paul has the 50's round contour its no surprise I didn't like it, but I didn't pay much attention to the rest of the guitar because I didn't like the feel.
Another thing Gibson are doing now is 2 piece backs!...just wrong! And I'm sorry but I don't like the fact that their standard LP range is weight relieved, I can understand it though and it is a great idea, but what about those of us that want one piece backs with no weight relief. I'd love a black custom and if I can ever afford another LP I won't be buying a new one that's for sure.

[stingx]

If you want it "old school" you have the reissues for a grand more :rlol:

It's all about dollars and cents, pounds, shillings, and pence.

[Bytor1975]

But since my Les Paul has the 50's round contour its no surprise I didn't like it, but I didn't pay much attention to the rest of the guitar because I didn't like the feel.Funny, I like the Fat 50's neck myself and thought the new neck was closer to the 50's than the 60's slim taper.

[Bytor1975]

If you want it "old school" you have the reissues for a grand more :rlol:
The reissue I want is several grand more... doubt I'll ever get it.

http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbase/pics/products/6/9/3/395693.jpg

http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gibson-Custom-Shop-1959-Les-Paul-Standard-VOS-Electric-Guitar?sku=517984

[stratcat51]

It's all about dollars and cents, pounds, shillings, and pence.

Ain't that the truth! :iagree:

[ldelo]

I just tore down, cleaned up, lubed/oiled/tweaked/filed/waxed/buffed/checked/etc a friends Studio from the early-mid 90's.

That Studio had some kiind of steel plate in the control cavity with the pots sort of wired loosely to the plate and then the pots nutted against the top when the plate was in place.

The plate thing on his was kind of messy and overall I was not impressed with it.

They used about 4-5 different guages of wire, some of the wires were so taught (as installed, not from anything moving) that a snag or shift here or there would've torn them loose, uninsulated wires criss-crossing with nothing more than space to keep them from shorting (and thus creating a buzz/hum/short/dropout), etc etc.

My point? A well designed and made PC board, particularly a thick one with beefy traces and perhaps gold plating etc, would've been a very VERY dramatic improvement over what I found in that Studio - *assuming* that is they resisted the urge to start using cheap tape-dispensed auto-inserted parts on the board(s) or made the board compatible with COTS pots/parts...

[Andoni]

Funny, I like the Fat 50's neck myself and thought the new neck was closer to the 50's than the 60's slim taper.




I have to agree with that, if compared to the 50's/60's neck then yes it is closer to 50's imo aswell, but the fret baord area is too wide. Sought of like an Ibanez neck is wide, I hope that makes sense and no I ain't saying the Gibby neck is like an Ibanez :lol:.
Funny how we adjust to the feel of a neck and then become very particular to that neck.

[Bytor1975]

I have to agree with that, if compared to the 50's/60's neck then yes it is closer to 50's imo aswell, but the fret baord area is too wide. Sought of like an Ibanez neck is wide, I hope that makes sense and no I ain't saying the Gibby neck is like an Ibanez :lol:.
Funny how we adjust to the feel of a neck and then become very particular to that neck.From what I read, their idea is to make it easy to change pots and pickups by using connectors of their design. They are supposed to be offereing their pickups and other electronic parts that will just 'plug' into the board as opposed to having to solder parts in. This is to make it easier for anyone to mod or work on their guitar (and sell more Gibson branded parts.)

[Andoni]

From what I read, their idea is to make it easy to change pots and pickups by using connectors of their design. They are supposed to be offereing their pickups and other electronic parts that will just 'plug' into the board as opposed to having to solder parts in. This is to make it easier for anyone to mod or work on their guitar (and sell more Gibson branded parts.)




Thats just a bad idea. I bought a guitar once that you build/paint yourself (cheap prs copy) and that had plug together male/female connectors and it was shocking. Could hear the pickups one minute, then gone, then back but with crackling :feiertag-.


Sold that gutar to a mate, should buy it back of him.

[Bytor1975]

That Studio had some kiind of steel plate in the control cavity with the pots sort of wired loosely to the plate and then the pots nutted against the top when the plate was in place.I believe they started doing the prewired drop in harness as far back as 30 years ago with Norlin's attempt to cheapen production and production line times.

http://mysite.verizon.net/jrfisher/Standard/Deluxe_B_38.jpg

[Andoni]

I can't believe this new 'traditional' Les Paul has replaced the Standard!! :speechles
Just because they went nuts and released a boat load of SHITE guitars (QC) doesn't mean they can fix it by discontinuing the model only to reintroduce it. If its happening now it will probably happen in the future too.....man some wankers really run these guitar companies :mad0177:

[ldelo]

I believe they started doing the prewired drop in harness as far back as 30 years ago with Norlin's attempt to cheapen production and production line times.

http://mysite.verizon.net/jrfisher/Standard/Deluxe_B_38.jpg
That looks much cleaner than what I ran into... Maybe my friends' was wired on a Monday morn or Friday afternoon before being assembled into the guitar. It did not appear to have been reworked, it just was not clean either.

I understand about the PC board in the new ones being a shortcut to cheaper and more consistent production and potentially cleaner parts swaps.

However if they make it so only their parts can be used without modifying (or removing entirely) the PC board (and possibly replacing it with some aftermarket thingie), all they will do is piss people off.

Why Gibbie and in different ways Fender keep doing things like that is beyond me...

[Justpickin]

Why Gibbie and in different ways Fender keep doing things like that is beyond me...
Because the aftermarket business is huge, and this way they can force you to buy OEM to keep that money in their pockets. Good business idea, if I was CEO of Gibson I'd push for that....plug and play part swap/upgrades, as easy as adding a card to your computer. Let's face it, people buy the LP's on name alone, they gotta have the "real deal". They could fill that cavity with dogshit and call it "new", and it'll sell. Give a bunch away to some "guitar gods" so we all see them playing them, and people will think they can sound like shit also by buying one......

[ldelo]

I understand the marketing etc advantages, as well as production/maintenence and etc advantages.

But that particular set of calculii are made solely from and are only advantageous to Gibson (Fender, etc) themselves and in terms of attempting to force customers back to the well for upgrades, swaps, etc etc.

The problem is, and my point was, that by attempting to do that you preclude an entire universe of options for the consumer and that will piss off a lot of people - particularly if they discover they can only use "genuine Gibson" parts, pups, etc AFTER the purchase.

It's like Gateway and their @#!@$#%$ motherboards (and apparently a lot of PC manufacturers have tried this) where they artificially limit how much memory and what peripherals, cards, etc one can add (a particular MB can accept.)

The notion (in their mind) is that *if* you want a machine you can upgrade post-sale, they want to at least force you to accept an up-sale at the time of purchase in order to get a machine+MB that is NOT artificially limited in the first place. Screw them. I bought one Gateway (eMachine) ONCE, discovered the scam and will NEVER buy another one from them. Period.

[Justpickin]

The problem is, and my point was, that by attempting to do that you preclude an entire universe of options for the consumer and that will piss off a lot of people - particularly if they discover they can only use "genuine Gibson" parts, pups, etc AFTER the purchase.
.
so far you're pissed......people will still buy LP's (ant's marching)....you won't. My first response still applies.

[vintage_brat]

I just tore down, cleaned up, lubed/oiled/tweaked/filed/waxed/buffed/checked/etc a friends Studio from the early-mid 90's.

That Studio had some kiind of steel plate in the control cavity with the pots sort of wired loosely to the plate and then the pots nutted against the top when the plate was in place.

The plate thing on his was kind of messy and overall I was not impressed with it.

They used about 4-5 different guages of wire, some of the wires were so taught (as installed, not from anything moving) that a snag or shift here or there would've torn them loose, uninsulated wires criss-crossing with nothing more than space to keep them from shorting (and thus creating a buzz/hum/short/dropout), etc etc.

My point? A well designed and made PC board, particularly a thick one with beefy traces and perhaps gold plating etc, would've been a very VERY dramatic improvement over what I found in that Studio - *assuming* that is they resisted the urge to start using cheap tape-dispensed auto-inserted parts on the board(s) or made the board compatible with COTS pots/parts...
The metal plate is a shielding plate that came standard on all Lp's until at least 1979. It should have also had a stamped metal pan that covered the controls and held by 2 #6 machine screws. The bare wires, depending on what they were, are probably Gibsons traditional braided shield wire. It should have also had a grounding terminal in the middle of the plate that was used as a common ground and solder lug.
I see these often and when they are not there I question why. When done properly they are very effective in their function. The pan and plate are very much part of the appraisal value and originality of Gibson LP Guitars. Most anyone familiar with the workings of older and vintage instruments are familar with traditional Gibson LP components.

The japanese attempted the PC board mounted pots in the early 80's and were not successful with it. The pots were crap, hard to replace and were junked by most and wired in a more traditional fashion.

Wires that are long and slack become mini antennas and cause even more noise . That is the reason for minimum amounts of wire runs in vintage and older instruments.

[ldelo]

Thanks for the details and etc.

What you describe sounds about right except that overall the one I had to deal with was messy, there were several guages of bare wire (only one of which was the braided sheath), and several of the bare wires were criss-crossed and close to touching.

Whether that was a stock get-up, a stock one that'd been hacked, or a hatchet job altogether I know not, except that overall nothing appeared to have been changed/resoldered/moved/messed-with.

[GoT MuLe 31788]

I started shopping around for a Les Paul yesterday. Nobody in my area has the Classic Custom w/P-90s that I've been drooling over online, damn it! So I go into the local Guitar Center and they have one 2008 LP Standard in Cherry Sunburst. Looking at it straight on it appears to be a plain top. But when looking down while in the playing position the flame really pops out. When I picked it up it felt extremely light. I know it's chambered, but I never thought a Lester could be lighter than my '02 American Strat! The new asymetrical neck profile was really comfortable and not as extreme as I expected. The Burst Bucker 1&2 pickups sounded fantastic.

My only complaints were the set up and the volume and tone knobs. When you turned the knobs, they wobble :WTF:! Not just one, all four of them! For $2600 you would think they could drill the hole for the pot shafts straight!! As for the action, the strings felt like rubber bands. I know, I'm used to playing Fenders strung with .10's. But the last time I played my Buddys Les Paul {a Joe Perry Bone Yard} the string tension felt fine. Maybe a good set- up could fix it?

So the search continues......
I didn't like it at all. Why change the neck. Players have been using those necks for decades. And all this locking stuff... C'mon its a Les Paul man. Ok I can see having a chambered body, but don't replace the Standard with it. Call it something else. I hope it doesn't last long. Also as far as set up you can't go by GC, they don't take care of the stuff they are trying to sell. Just my .02.

Thanks for listening to my rant had to get it off my chest. Prob. the only one you'll hear from me on Gibsons, as I'm that devoted to them lol.

Ben

[Ron Siwicki]

Luckily I bought a regular Les Paul Standard about two years ago and I got an exceptional one with a very comfortable neck and a flame top that I am told by the salesmen at the store is better than most premium plus models that they have seen. I will try to attach a picture here.

[Jossy]

Luckily I bought a regular Les Paul Standard about two years ago and I got an exceptional one with a very comfortable neck and a flame top that I am told by the salesmen at the store is better than most premium plus models that they have seen. I will try to attach a picture here.


That LP looks really nice, Ron.

Saludos.